Innovation Junkies Podcast

Scott Howe on the Two Wells of Innovation

The Jeffs chat with Scott Howe, CEO at LiveRamp. Can’t-miss topics include: how enterprise leaders can combine data & innovation, exciting new trends in technology, innovation & data, & how customers & people are “wells” of innovation.

Jeff Standridge: This is Jeff Standridge and this is the Innovation Junkies Podcast. If you want to drastically improve your business, learn proven growth strategy and generate sustained results for your organization, you’ve come to the right place. Over the next half hour we’re going to be sharing specific strategies, tactics and tips that you can use to grow your business no matter the size, no matter the industry, no matter the geography. Weekly, we’ll bring in a top mover and shaker someone who’s done something unbelievable in his or her business and we’ll dig deep. We’ll uncover specific strategies, tactics, and tools that they’ve used to help you achieve your business goals. Welcome to the Innovation Junkies Podcast.

Hey guys, if you’re looking to put your business on the fast track to achieving sustained strategic growth, this episode is sponsored by the team at Innovation Junkie to learn more about our growth DX, go to innovationjunkie.com\growthDX. Now, let’s get on with the show.

Jeff Standridge: Hey guys, Jeff Standridge here. Welcome to the Innovation Junkies Podcast.

Jeff Amerine: And this is Jeff Amerine and I’m glad to be back. We’ve got another great guest today. Who have we got, Jeff?

Jeff Standridge: Yes, we do, guys. We have Scott Howe with us today. Scott is the chief executive officer of LiveRamp, the leading data connectivity platform for the safe and effective use of data. I got to know Scott a number of years ago when he joined Axciom Corporation, as the CEO. And Scott has a phenomenal career, educated as an economist, actually then went on to get his MBA at Harvard, has been in a number of startup companies and large enterprises, including Microsoft, aQuantive. His teams built one of the world’s largest digital agencies avenue, a razorfish, pioneered people-based media buying through drive performance media that then became known as the Microsoft Media Network, just all around great guy, fantastic leader, a strong innovator.

Jeff Standridge: Scott, we are tickled to death, as we would say here in the south to have you with us today.

Scott Howe: Well, Jeff, it’s great to join you today. It’s a real pleasure. And as I mentioned earlier, I feel like we should flip the microphone and I should be interviewing you because when I think about innovators, I think of you, not me.

Jeff Standridge: Well, I appreciate that. You’re very gracious that I appreciate that, but we’re very excited to have you. We didn’t tell you this in the beginning, but we like to generally have a random musing, something that we just kind of throw out there and say, “What are we going to muse on here to start with?” And today’s random musing is your favorite summertime activity.

Scott Howe: Oh, wow. I’ll tell you what I did last weekend. I have this place that has a cement tennis court and basketball court and it just fall into disrepair. So, I got on my hands and knees, I laid 10,600 rubber tiles and turned it into the be all end, all sports court. It’s got tennis, it’s got basketball. I set up one of those big basketball hoops for my boys. It’s got shuffleboard for me because I’m like an old decrepit guy now.

Jeff Standridge: Wow.

Scott Howe: And so, my prediction for this summer is me and my family, we’re going to spend a lot of time enjoying that sport court. If not my knees and backs are going to let me know that it was a waste of time.

Jeff Standridge: I started to say, oh my God, that sounds like an awesome summertime activity. And I thought better of it though.

Scott Howe: That was pretty so on Monday.

Jeff Standridge: Oh, I can’t imagine. Jeff, how about you?

Jeff Amerine: Yeah, I was just sitting here trying to contemplate that. I would have to say that I really liked trail running in the summer and really it’s year round. But particularly now when it’s pretty hot out, most of those soft surface trails are tree covered and whatnot. And I don’t go as fast as I used to. It’s kind of a combat shuffle, which is sort of a old warrior’s definition of barely a jog. But I love doing that. I love trail running and I’m glad to be back into it.

Jeff Standridge: Fantastic. Well, I love cycling. It’s really more of my favorite winter time activity or fall spring activity. During the summer it’s got to be spending time on the lake, [inaudible 00:04:27] Lake, on the pontoon with the kids and their significant others and my wife as well. So, that would be mine. Scott, let’s talk a little bit, just kind of give our listeners some background on Scott Howe, maybe a little bit of a discussion of your career and kind of how you came to be where you are just quickly, if you don’t mind.

Scott Howe: Sure. Jeff, I’ve somehow become a data guru and that was never my intent, but it’s the old cliche that a long journeys are best divided into short steps. And I’ve taken a lot of short steps to get to this point. It started out in investment banking, which taught me analytics and numbers and a work ethic that I went into management consulting at the Boston Consulting Group. It had a reputation of being a real analytics driven shop. They sent me to Australia where I worked on Qantas Airlines, their route profitability systems and yield management systems, massive amounts of data. And what I realized is that companies that had data made better decisions than those that don’t. And so, at the time I said, are there any industries that have massive amount of data? Well, the internet, it was just starting in the mid 90s.

Scott Howe: So, I joined a startup called aQuantive. Our tagline was, know what works. And it was all about the data. A few years later, we were acquired by Microsoft and I spent time at Microsoft running a lot of their data businesses, Microsoft advertising. And what I learned is data’s only as good as your ability to stitch it together, which required identity and a company called Acxiom was the leader in identity. And so when they called me to see if I want to interview for their CEO job in Arkansas, I knew a lot about what they were doing and where it could go and so lo and behold, here we are.

Jeff Standridge: So, a little bit about that story. So, you came to Acxiom Corporation and that’s where we had the pleasure of meeting and working together. I think I was strung out in multiple geographies around the globe when that took place. And then this little small company that was acquired by Acxiom ended up making some very… Acxiom made some very strategic decisions, innovative decisions, certainly that resulted in a spinning off of the original legacy Acxiom Corporation and a rising up if you will of the company that was acquired the LiveRamp. So, talk a little bit about the process that you went through there, the innovation that’s inherent in that, and then what’s transpired since then.

Scott Howe: Well, it’s interesting. I’m a big believer in focus. So, one of the things you’ve probably heard me talk about Jeff is burgers, shakes and fries that companies need to figure out what their equivalent of burgers, shakes and fries are, and be really good at that before they start adding cookies and mixed salads and whatever else to the menu. And the Acxiom that I joined was super interesting because they were good at a couple things, really good at those things. They were very good at identity, and I thought identity had a chance to really be stitching the Rosetta stone that anyone who use data would need to utilize. That was very much a technology and a data play. The path forward there was about innovation. And then there was a big services business, and we were amazing in Acxiom at services, but the services of the technology didn’t always go together well.

Scott Howe: So, ultimately to find each business its own best home, we ended up selling the Acxiom services business to IPG, and that services, the data services, the marketing services business, when partnered with an agency services business at IPG, it just accelerated that side of the business. And then on the other side of that technology and the data side, we made an acquisition at Acxiom of a company called LiveRamp, which was very complimentary. Acxiom had an offline identity spine called a bill attack. Just a brilliant invention that you were part of bringing to market, Jeff a couple decades ago. That was the leader, it was the category creator. It was absolutely essential, but as the world became more digital LiveRamp had kind of a digital of anonymous identity that worked with things like mobile ad identifiers and cookies and IP addresses. And the combination of those digital capabilities with the offline identity capabilities actually really was a tale of one plus one equals far more than two.

Jeff Standridge: Fantastic. Fantastic. Tell us about LiveRamp now. What are you guys doing?

Scott Howe: Oh, super exciting. Half a billion dollars, 1200 people. We worked with some of the biggest companies on the planet expanding rapidly overseas and at the center of what a lot of the brands that you all love. We’re at the center of what they’re trying to do from a marketing and communications and commerce perspective. So, it’s just a lot of fun.

Jeff Standridge: Fantastic. Let’s talk about just this concept of innovation. As you know, we’ve talked about innovation is what we’re about here and what this podcast is about. And talk a little bit about how enterprise leaders use data and maybe the intersection of data and innovation.

Scott Howe: Well, Jeff, I think what you’re doing is so important because when I look at companies overall and particularly companies in the technology world, they’re like sharks. The moment they stop innovating, the moment they stop moving forward, they start dying, but it’s a slow, painful death. But all of the studies that I’ve ever seen is that R&D spend is a precursor to growth. If you invest in innovation and satisfy your clients, then the growth will come, but it’s got to be smart R&D. If you remember, I know Jeff, you’re a baseball fan, right? And so, there’s that old movie, like 20 years or more ago called Field of Dreams. And in it Kevin Costner is walking through the field and here’s the, “If you build it, they will come.” And that’s not quite true in our space. We got to say, “If we build it, who will come? How often will they come? At what price points?”

Scott Howe: And so innovation needs to be a hypothesis driven and accountable. You have to be smart about innovation. You just can’t throw money at innovation and hope for the best. You have to be very scientific around, what are you building? Why and what will the outcome be?

Jeff Standridge: So, how do you go about cultivating a team that balances that decision-making based upon the empirical evidence versus that more qualitative customer discovery, stakeholder kind of evidence?

Scott Howe: Well, it’s interesting. One of the great myths of business is that innovation stems from the leader. And maybe guys like Steve Jobs, that was true, but they meet more. I mean, for every Bill Gates or Steve Jobs, there’s thousands of CEOs who cannot possibly be the smartest person in the room. And I’m certainly not the smartest person in the room when I’m meeting with our team. Innovation doesn’t flow top down, rather it trickles up from a thousand sources and a leader’s job is to catch it, to prioritize it and to harness the power. And I’ve always believed there are two main sources, two main wells that run deep when it comes to innovation. The first are our customers, any business’s customers, they know where they want you to go. They know what the problems are that need to be solved. And so rather than lock yourself in a dark room and say, “What could I do? What’s the next big thing?”

Scott Howe: It’s much better to get out in the clear line of day to travel and meet your customers, to get on phone calls and to listen to them, listen, and truly hear, truly hear what it is that they want you to solve. And at LiveRamp, we do that at a number of ways. We have a voice of the customer series, where we invite customers in, we learn about their lives. We hear about their views. We hear about their pain points, very similar to what you’re doing with your podcasts, but the emphasis of our podcasts or our customers and the audiences, everybody internally, because it sparks innovation to hear our customers talk. We’ve started up a customer advisory boards. We’ll bring a lot of customers in at once and then ask them questions around, “Should we do this? Or should we do this? Would you like this feature, this feature or this feature?”

Scott Howe: And just hear them talk, hear them help us guide our roadmap. We have a annual customer event called RampUp where we bring a couple of years ago, it was 6,000 customers together. And we put them on stage to talk to one another. And through those conversations, through those interactions, a lot of sparks are created and out of that comes innovation. And the second big well of innovation, it’s people. There’s an old cliche, but it’s absolutely true. Amazing companies are always, always built around exceptional people. And I view my job as a leader, as help set the strategy, but then get out of the way. Like I do not want to micromanage people rather, the key is to say, “Here’s what we’re trying to accomplish. You figure it out.”

Scott Howe: And when you give people that empowerment of you figure it out, no constraints, you figure it out. As long as you act legally, as long as you act within our values, as long as you’re doing what’s right for our clients, you can do it any way you want. And that freedom gives people to rethink their processes, their UI, their products, and come up with a better mouse trap. And all of a sudden, if it’s not one person or a leadership team innovating, but it’s thousands of clients and thousands of employees all feeling that it’s their job to voice their pain points. It’s their job to find a better way. Then the magic happens and you start to become a truly innovative company.

Jeff Amerine: Scott, as a follow on to that, you talked about a bunch of really key points there. And you’ve obviously done a whole lot of customer interaction. What are you seeing is kind of the next big things, the cool trends in technology and innovation and data that have got you excited? What’s your crystal ball look like for the next few years?

Scott Howe: Oh wow. In the data world, there’s probably three things that we’re really excited about right now. One is just the rise of data and knowledge, and we all experienced this. You don’t need to work at a data company to realize that Amazon and Google and Facebook, they’re not necessarily retailers and publishers as much as they are data companies. For anybody who’s listening to this podcast, it’s a really interesting article. You can just Google it. There’s a BBC article on it, What Amazon Knows About Me. And it exposes all of the data that Amazon has collected on the reporter over the course of the year. And it’s truly jaw dropping. And as a retailer, as a packaged goods manufacturer, you very quickly realize you can’t out Amazon, Amazon, but what you can do and what any company can do is figure out who are their partners, that if they collaborate with data more effectively together, they can generate a better result.

Scott Howe: And so, we’re seeing this huge in what we’re calling data collaboration. It’s the major travel company partnering with the major financial services companies and together building better products. It’s retailers and the merchants who lined their shelves sharing data to give customers better in-the-store experiences, better merchandising, better couponing. There’s no limit to where that can go. It’s really exciting. A second big trend that we’re seeing that’s sparking innovation is a real improvement in consumer privacy. It’s happening at the regulation level with GDPR and CCPA, the California Consumer Protection Act. It’s also happening because responsible stewards in the industry are being more transparent, giving consumers more choice and control over what data is collected and how it’s utilized. And so, that’s really exciting because we’re right in the middle of that, and we’re helping customers, we’re helping marketers and businesses describe their offerings better, such that the value proposition to a consumer around why they might share data is much clearer.

Scott Howe: They have much more control over it. And in the marketing space, they’re exposed to better offers with brands they love. In the education space they get more knowledge. In government, it helps governments provide better services to its citizens. And in healthcare using data effectively helps people live longer, healthier lives. So, there’s just a real noble purpose to making the exchange between people and the companies that can use their data or the governments that can use their data, making that very visible, transparent, and that sparks innovation. And then the third area, and this is long-winded so I’ll wrap it up is around security.

Scott Howe: Data is valuable and sometimes data is sensitive. And so, it’s very important to keep it secure and ensure that it’s utilized for the purposes that it was intended and not for the purposes that it was not intended. And we’re really excited about a concept called federated machine learning. It allows the insights from data to be extracted without data ever having to move. And so, from a security perspective, that does wonder for companies because they can control their data. They’re a lot less worried about security breaches, but they can unlock the power of the insights at an anonymous, encrypted and secure way.

Jeff Standridge: Hey folks, we’ll be right back with the episode. But first we want to tell you about a limited opportunity to take advantage of our growth DX. For a limited time, we’re offering a free strategy call to see whether our unique diagnostic tool is right for you. Go to innovationjunkie.com\growthDX to learn more.

Jeff Standridge: I want to go back a moment, Scott, and you talked about privacy and security and back in the days of Acxiom and certainly in the days of LiveRamp as well, Acxiom made a decision to be an innovator and an early adopter in the data world, in the areas of privacy insecurity. Talk about how that has transpired and how that has continued in the days of LiveRamp and what you do today.

Scott Howe: Yeah, Jeff, it’s really interesting. You could probably remember when I joined Acxiom within a couple months, we had, I can’t remember if it was 60 minutes or MSNBC. It was one of those cable news channels. They came knocking on our door and they said, “Hey, we heard Acxiom is a big data company. What data do you have about me?” And at the time we couldn’t tell them at an individual level what we knew about them, because it was impossible to gather all that information and put it in a vehicle that was digestible by the individual. And I’ll tell you that question really hit home with me because it’s the question I had when I joined Acxiom. “A data company, what do you know about me, Scott Howe?” And I just thought, “Hey, everybody has that question.” And then a world where data is becoming much more important don’t they have the right to know.

Scott Howe: So at the time you’ll recall, we created a portal called about the data. And at about the data, you could go as a consumer and you could verify who you were and see all the information that Axiom and its data network had collected. You could correct it, you could opt out. And we were really worried at the time that by exposing this we’re the first company to do that consumers would come and opt out in mass. And what we found is that didn’t happen rather when people came to the website and got educated about what kind of information we had and how it was utilized, the vast majority over 99% of consumers got very comfortable with that. And we had sections on that portal where people could give us comments and the most common comment we had was, “Where can I tell you more about my favorite companies because I want to develop tighter relationships with them?”

Scott Howe: And the important thing on data is everybody has a different standard. So, my kids are really comfortable sharing information. I’m very comfortable sharing most of my information, and there are still others who are not comfortable sharing any of their information. And I believe it needs to be up to the consumer to actually express what their preference is and unlock the value exchange that they’re comfortable with and know what every step along the way what’s collected and why. And the good news is relative to boy, 10, 20 years ago, that is exactly the direction that the data world is heading in. Not that it’s going to shake out the illicit players. And it’s going to spark innovation amongst those who have noble intents.

Jeff Amerine: What role if any, do you see blockchain playing in, in some of that the decentralized control and more individual control of their data? I’d be really interested in your thoughts around blockchain?

Scott Howe: Yeah, Jeff, it’s a great question. And I think we, and a lot of other companies are trying to figure that out right now. Certainly, it is a phenomenal invention and for Bitcoin or whatever digital currency, it’s a necessity. It’s application to data, we haven’t seen as much progress there. I suspect it will come, but we haven’t seen kind of the killer application and a lot of consumer embrace of it. I wonder if that will come as digital currency becomes a little bit more mainstream and blockchain becomes less the realm of technical geeks like us and more of a mainstream thing that consumers are familiar with.

Jeff Standridge: Scott, I’m going to keep going back into something that you said, you talked about the two wells and you gave us a great understanding of how you utilize customers and how you partner with customers to really understand what they need. You also talked about innovation coming from the well of people and that the leader’s role is to catch and prioritize innovation versus to drive innovation. Can you talk to us a little bit about how you build the culture of leadership, the culture of innovation among your leadership, because with 1500 employees, you now have a few hundred leaders there who have the ability to attempt to drive innovation or squelch innovation, or maybe not cultivate it to the degree that maybe you would, and so, how do you build that leadership culture of innovation?

Scott Howe: Yeah, I’m a believer that culture is a fabric that’s knit to earn, and everybody contributes some threads in the overall tapestry. The folks that we recruit, the very people that we welcome to our culture, we talk a lot about the kind of people that we want to be and the kind of company we want to be. Very early in the recruiting process we send out to any interested candidates, a copy of our LiveRamp values. And it’s not just high-level platitudes, but we actually go into, well, what does it mean? We will talk about specific behaviors and the how it shows up at work. We talk extensively for instance, about it’s more important to do what’s right than be right. And then we talk about, well, what does that mean? And it means that we give people permission to make mistakes, mistakes of good intention.

Scott Howe: We want them to try things. We want them to fail, and then we want them to learn rapidly. In fact, we will celebrate failures, especially if it causes us to change course. And maybe deprioritize something that wasn’t working or reprioritize towards things that are working more effectively. From the moment that someone comes into our organization, in our training and onboarding process, we talk about transparency in what we value and how we want people to interact. And again, we want people to speak their mind. We want them to deliver unvarnished versions of the truth, because we know that anything other than that just creates bureaucracy and opacity when we want to move fast and we want transparency on how everything’s working.

Scott Howe: So, it starts with recruiting. It continues with onboarding and then it culminates with what we reward. We celebrate people who take chances. We find ways for them to take chances. Several times in the last couple of years, team members have come up with a great idea, oftentimes sparked with a client. And we’ve said, “Okay, that’s a great idea, spin up a team, we’ll put it in an incubation and see where it goes.” We give them autonomy. We give them resources. We give them visibility across the organization. And when they succeed, we celebrate the heck out of them, such that others want to travel that same path, but it’s got to be every step. And I’ll tell you that story. I think about this a lot in terms of culture and branding. Jeff, you’ve heard me say this before years ago, I went to Starbucks to talk to Howard Schultz, that was late 90s. And we were talking about the essence of the Starbucks brand. And his point was the brand is everything.

Scott Howe: It’s how you merchandise the store. It’s the smell when you walk in, it’s how the baristas greet you. It’s the quality of the coffee you drink. And so too, to the culture, it’s everything, it’s all these little pieces. And if you don’t focus on all of them and make them consistent, then the culture starts to fall over. It starts to become disconnected. It starts to become inconsistent and that rips an organization apart, but when you take the time to say, “Okay, what we say in recruiting is going to be the things we emphasize in onboarding, it’s going to be the things we celebrate along the way that all of a sudden it’s consistent at every step.” And then all of a sudden it starts to take out a multiplicative force and innovation and entrepreneurship, and course correction. All of those things become even faster and better.

Jeff Amerine: Scott, a follow-up on that. You’ve emphasized talent and culture and whatnot. And you made the really good baseball movie reference earlier. So, I’m going to take you to Brad Pitt in Moneyball. As you think about the Moneyball. So, the Moneyball stat for the A’s was on base percentage. That was the thing that unlocked everything else. It didn’t matter if they were prototypical, if they kind of fit the profile or it looked right, it was on base percentage. As you think about what you do at LiveRamp. And as you think about the innovators you want to hire, is there a Moneyball on base percentage type of stat that means more than anything else when you look at bringing innovators into the company?

Scott Howe: Ooh, that’s a really interesting question. I will tell you, there are two things I always look for in candidates. And it goes back 25 years ago, when I was at the Boston Consulting Group, they tapped me to run MBA recruiting for a short period of time. And one of the things we looked at just for kicks and giggles, and we had a mammoth amount of longitudinal data. And so, we looked at, from the moment someone was hired, if you just saw their resume to later in their careers, were they succeeding or not, what were the predictors? And we ran a massive regression and two things came out as statistically significant.

Scott Howe: Number one, did they play college athletics? And the theory behind that was there’s some degree of being in a team environment or an athletics environment that teaches you persistence, hard work, teamwork, collaboration, whole host of things that are really important to navigating the modern organization. And the second thing was an indication of math prowess, GMAT score. I say, T score, it didn’t matter, but just something that suggested you were off the charts mathematically. And our interpretation of that was that that might be an indication of what I would call kind of quick twitch smarts. Have you ever had a conversation about a colleague and the words you use to describe that colleague or he, or she just gets it. You’re having a conversation, they immediately get it and they run with it and they build on it.

Scott Howe: And I don’t know what that is, how to describe it, but I’ve always said it’s quick twitch. And boy, when you find someone who knows how to work as a team and also has quick twitch smarts, they can change the world because they make everybody around them better. They take someone else’s idea and they polish it and they say, “Well, what if you did this? Or that’s interesting, what if we layered in this?” And then all of a sudden, the ideas iterate and become better and better and better over time. So, I get a great question, Jeff. I haven’t thought about that in 20 years, but it’s always those two things that we look for.

Jeff Amerine: Oh, that’s gold. That’s that is definitely gold or rapid dot connector. And somebody that has been through a team environment and competitive sports, those are gems. Thank you for sharing that.

Jeff Standridge: So, I was just actually looking and we’re two days away from the seven-year anniversary of Acxiom’s closing on the Live Ramp acquisition.

Scott Howe: Oh, wow.

Jeff Standridge: At that time at that it was July, the first of 2014. At that time there were 70 employees. What, 30 million in revenue, maybe something like that.

Scott Howe: Well, when we bought it, it was 15,000,000 and 20 people. And now it’s 1200 and 500 millions. Yeah. So we’re nice success story.

Jeff Standridge: And so, it is a nice success story. So tell us, what are your burgers, shakes and fries?

Scott Howe: Oh, we’re not a whole lot different than what you probably remember, Jeff. It starts with access to data. We believe that finding the world’s information is inherently a difficult process. So, if we can do turnkey integrations and make that information easier to ingest that delivers huge value for clients, it then goes to identity. That identity is the very thing that allows disparate pieces of information that might be sitting in two different silos. It allows you to stitch those together to a common, a common individual or a common unit. It then goes to insights. How can you manipulate the data and extract knowledge from it? And then finally it’s about activation of how can you utilize the data in the moments that matter and make that very easy and determine what it means. And, oh, by the way, do all that in a private secure, encrypted methodology, such that data is treated sensitively and appropriately.

Scott Howe: But all of that we believe is a very specialized set of skills. And the world is really well-served when a player like us provides those services across the industry, such that they’re predictable and portable across different folks in the industry and it all becomes interoperable. Everybody can work with one another safely and securely and extract the power of data.

Jeff Standridge: Well, Scott, it has been an absolute pleasure talking to you. You’ve described a textbook case here, I believe should be a textbook case or a case study in making difficult decisions to focus on the core and what is the future of a company. Excuse me, a lot of difficult decisions there with the distribution or the spinning off, if you will, of a number of legacy assets that played their role and could be played even better in a different organization i.e the Acxiom and IPG relationship that I think ended up being great for everyone there, but great for LiveRamp as well. Congratulations on your success over the last several years and years to come certainly.

Scott Howe: Well, Jeff, thank you. It’s always a pleasure to spend time with you, my friend. And again, I would encourage any listeners to your podcast. If they haven’t heard the Jeff standard story, they need to, because you are one of the most talented and creative people that I’ve ever met. And so thank you for inviting me to join you today.

Jeff Standridge: It’s been a pleasure. Any parting words of wisdom, you’d leave our listeners?

Scott Howe: Continue to tune into the Jeff and Jeff podcast theories. There’s a lot of value to unlock there. This is gold.

Jeff Standridge: Well, thanks so much. Hope to see you again soon.

Jeff Amerine: Thanks, Scott.

Jeff Standridge: Thanks for being with us and everyone. Thank you for joining the Innovation Junkies Podcast. We’ll see you on the next episode.

Jeff Amerine: Hey folks, this is Jeff Amerine, we want to thank you for tuning in. We sincerely appreciate your time. If you’re enjoying the Innovation Junkies Podcast, please do us a huge favor. Click the subscribe button right now, and please leave us a review. It would mean the world to both of us, and don’t forget to share us on social media.

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